Why Soft Leadership Kills Team Production & Profit?

[00:00:00] If you are watching, I'm dropping the link to the registration page in the comments. And if you just click it, you can read all about it. Makes it easy. Yeah, we even made a fancy video for you. There's a video there of us talking about it and stuff. So check it out. And San Antonio, I don't know, San Antonio is a pretty cool place. They got the Riverwalk.

[00:00:30] Riverwalk, a lot of history there. And there is a, I've been there once, and there is a Brazilian steakhouse there. I don't know if you've done the Brazilian steakhouse thing before. Oh yeah. So if you like to eat steak and all kinds of good meats and stuff, come to San Antonio, we'll treat you. They've got some amazing barbecue. Okay, yeah. So you have to compare it to your New Orleans barbecue, see if it passes the test.

[00:00:59] See if it's good enough. Okay, yeah. Well, if you want barbecue, you've got to go north. You've got to go to Tennessee. Yeah. That's the barbecue place. Well, Kansas City might have something to say about that. Maybe so. Yeah. Fair. Very cool. So today's live, we're talking about some things that everyone, every owner is obviously working on or thinking about if they have any other providers on their team. And that is provider productivity and team communication.

[00:01:28] How you get your providers to be productive. Let's lock in. Lock in on this topic. I almost feel like passing the baton to you because this is all you've been working on for the past six years, dude. Well, it's really like the last 12 months. It's been like really hard. I know there's going to be people, X people on my team that see this and they're going to be like, yeah, that was terrible. You know, so good news is I know what not to do.

[00:01:58] And I know what's needed to be in place in order to do it. I think so. Hopefully you guys can learn a little bit from the lessons that I've learned along the way. And, you know, yeah, we'll go from there. Welcome to the Private Practice Owners Club. Your hosts and coaches, Nathan Shields, scaled his practice and exited for millions.

[00:02:20] While Adam Robin went from working 60 hours a week in one clinic to scaling to multiple clinics while working less than four hours per week remotely. This podcast is meant to share with you exactly how they did it and how you can build a business that supports the lifestyle that you truly desire. And don't forget to join the Private Practice Owners Club community on Facebook, where we are obsessed with providing even more resources that help owners just like you win the game of private practice.

[00:02:53] Hey, it's Nathan. Quick heads up for all the private practice owners who are listening. If you've been listening to the podcast for a while, you know that it took me at least 10 years of grinding in my own clinics before I finally figured out how to scale and sell my four practices for seven figures and about three times the national average. The biggest shift wasn't some secret marketing hack. It was how I thought about profit systems and actually my role as the owner.

[00:03:22] That's exactly what we're going to be working on together with you at the High Performance Practice Conference this fall in San Antonio, Texas. From October 15th through 17th, Adam Robin and I are hosting a three-day hands-on event for PT, OT, speech, mental health, PEDS, pelvic floor, and medical practice owners who want to build clinics that are profitable, scalable, and best of all, don't depend on them 24-7.

[00:03:50] We'll dig into simple profit and KPI frameworks, real leadership and culture work, and practical systems you can take home and plug in with your team. So if you're doing roughly six to seven low figures a year and you want your clinic to feel more like a real business and less like a job slash cage, I'd love to see you there. Frankly, I'd love to see you bring your leadership teams as well because we will have breakout sessions for them too. You can get all the details and grab your seat at the link in the show notes.

[00:04:19] All right, let's get into today's episode. Welcome everyone to Facebook Live. This is right in line with the High Performance Practice Series that we're doing on the podcast. We're also doing associated Facebook Lives all leading up to the conference in October, October 15th through 17th, the High Performance Practice Conference led out by the Private Practice Owners Club. Go to ppoclubevents.com to check it out.

[00:04:47] ppoclubevents.com, high performance practice series October 15th through 17th in San Antonio, Texas. We're excited about it. If you are watching, I'm dropping the link to the registration page in the comments. And if you just click it, you can read all about it. Makes it easy. Yeah. We even made a fancy video for you. You know, there's a video there of us like talking about it and stuff. So check it out. Should be good stuff.

[00:05:17] And San Antonio, I don't know, like San Antonio's a pretty cool place. They got the boardwalk or the riverwalk. I'm sorry. The riverwalk. Riverwalk, a lot of history there. And there is a, I've been there once and there is a Brazilian steakhouse there. I don't know if you've done the Brazilian steakhouse thing before. Oh yeah. So if you like to eat steak and all kinds of good meats and stuff, come to San Antonio. We'll treat you.

[00:05:46] They've got some amazing barbecue. Okay. Yeah. So you have to compare it to your New Orleans barbecue. See if it passes the test. See if it's good enough. Yeah. Well, if you want barbecue, you got to go north. You got to go to Tennessee. Yeah. That's the barbecue. That's the barbecue place. Well, Kansas City might have something to say about that. Maybe so. Yeah. Very cool.

[00:06:10] So today's live, we're talking about some things that everyone, every owner is obviously working on or thinking about if they have any other providers on their team. And that is provider productivity and team communication. How your providers to be productive. Let's lock in. Lock in on this topic. I almost feel like passing the baton to you because this is all you've been working on for the past six years, dude.

[00:06:39] Well, it's really like the last 12 months. It's been really hard. I know there's going to be people, X people on my team that see this and they're going to be like, yeah, that was terrible. You know? So good news is I know what not to do and I know what's needed to be in place in order to do it. I think so. Hopefully you guys can learn a little bit from the lessons that I've learned along the way. And yeah, we'll go from there.

[00:07:05] Well, I'm trying to think of where to start because we can talk about team productivity and of course, me being a numbers dude, I'm thinking, okay, set the expectations, figure out your break evens. What do they got to generate in order to justify their salary and compensation? There's a lot of metrics involved in making sure you share that during the interview process, what's expected out of them and not just the number of visits, but how we bill.

[00:07:33] And do we start there or do we, do we focus on communication? Right. Part of this is team communication and what that looks like. I don't, which direction do you think we should start first? I tend to think that, uh, starting with the metrics is usually the best place. You know, I mean, if you're going to, you got to know your metrics, you know what I mean? Like you got to know your metrics. There's really two things that you need to get this to go. It's, it's, you got to have your systems in place.

[00:08:02] You have to have your systems, your component, your metrics dialed in, and you got to have the culture and the communication to support it. But I think it's really hard, even with a great culture. And if you start pushing metrics into a team, even though they're, they're happy, but they're also like used to doing things a certain way. Like change is hard. Change is hard, no matter what.

[00:08:28] So I feel like getting that expectation buttoned up and clear on the front end is probably the prerequisite in my opinion. Yeah. And we've had plenty of conversations and podcasts about what it means to set the expectation. And that goes back to, you got to know your breakeven points in terms of visits and revenue. You got to know what those providers need to generate in order to justify or have an even

[00:08:55] exchange with the compensation that they're receiving. And you've got to tie that to the number of visits that they're seeing per week. You've also got to be really clear about this is how we charge. This is how we maximize reimbursement for the amazing services that we provide. We're not just going to bill willy nilly a bunch of three TheraX one manuals because nowadays that's the worst reimbursement that you can get.

[00:09:23] And, uh, and we're going to have objective conversations thing. We're going to have a data driven organization, right? And I think that has to become part of the culture to make that communication the easiest, because like you said, most owners don't start in this space. They don't start working off of statistics, metrics, and numbers. They usually start because they know they're great therapists.

[00:09:53] They want to do their own thing. That's a goal they've always had. And so the culture, when you first start out is it's a one man show. So you are the culture of the organization, but as you grow, the need to have metrics and standards and expectations in place becomes more and more vital. And the tendency, if you're not careful, is that emotions and feelings start to guide your

[00:10:22] decision-making instead of the metrics, right? And so it's important that you understand all those metrics so you can have an objective understanding of what's happening in your business. You have a clear idea of the health and status of your organization so that you can make bold, good decisions in a quick manner to correct what's going on. And also to make it most efficient, profitable. I mean, if you want to achieve all your goals as a owner, you have to know these metrics, right?

[00:10:51] You can't just go willy nilly. We're not in that space anymore. Unfortunately. Yeah. But it makes us better business owners. It helps us learn and grow because we are both a testament to, because we knew our numbers in our organization became better business people, opportunities in other businesses start to show themselves. Sure. Right. Right. And we can take what we've learned and not only incorporate it into these physical therapy

[00:11:17] practice and be successful at it, we can take what we've learned into other offshoots, if other business ventures, if you are small business minded and apply those same principles and be successful there as well. Right. So knowing that metrics are the drivers is super important. So we talked about then add on to this a little bit. Not that we want to get into each aspect, but got to know our break evens. We got to know the expectations in visits revenue.

[00:11:46] We've got to know things like compensation ratios against total revenue. We've got to know what our billers are billing on average. We need to know their utilization rates. Right. These are all part and parcel to production. What more would you add to that? I would say, you know, the first thing that kind of comes to mind is you don't have to make it more complicated than it needs to be. It's actually surprisingly simple.

[00:12:14] It's not that complicated of a, you know, you only need like three metrics, you know, like you just need to know like what your average reimbursement per visit is. Right. You need to know, like you said, your break even like what are your costs per visits and basically how many visits do I need per provider in order to create a stable financial foundation for the practice. That generates a significant profit. Yeah.

[00:12:41] And you have those two metrics, those three metrics, you can pretty much find all these other things that we're talking about. Right. Yeah. It's pretty much it. And if you have a good front desk person who understands what the break even is and what that schedule needs to look like in order to give your providers an opportunity to hit the number. And if you have some providers who are aware of their expectation and they're doing it consistently, then you should be fine.

[00:13:08] Most of the time, you should be pretty close to fine most months. And that's all it really needs to be. I think that's the kind of like the systems component, the hard data side of the business, which is more analytical. It's more tedious. It's more boring. You crunching numbers and spreadsheets after work or on the weekends to try to like figure out what that model needs to look like. I think the other side of it is the harder side.

[00:13:37] Like once you get that in place and you're like, okay, I know the science behind this now. Right. I know the data. Now I got to get people to do it. That's true. That's the hard part. And that is something that isn't as, you know, like I can flip a number on a spreadsheet and make it say exactly what I want today. Yeah.

[00:14:02] But to like create that change with people that takes time. That's, that's gotta be massaged. That's gotta be rolled out in a way that is, there's a lot more emotions that come in to play and like having some really strong leadership skills and some, honestly, a really good team that supports your vision. I think it's just so critical to being able to do that. Yeah. I will just to backtrack a little bit. And I totally agree with you.

[00:14:31] Crunching the numbers isn't the hard part. And I would recommend if you are not a numbers person, get a bookkeeper, leverage your CPA and say, Hey, help me find these metrics. What do I need to know? So, I mean, they can tell you, right? They can help you out in that regard. And so you finding the numbers, like you said, can be difficult, but once you find them, then they're there on the piece of paper and you found them once you can find them again and you can adjust because my costs have changed or yada, yada, yada.

[00:15:00] And so starting with the basis of knowing your metrics now, it transfers into how do we translate these expectations and these numbers into real life so that we are producing what we're expecting to produce or needing to produce. Hey owners, before we get into the episode, I want to talk to you about our annual private practice owners club conference, the high performance practice conference, October 15th through 17th in San Antonio, Texas. We're really excited about it.

[00:15:28] Listen, if you're listening to the podcast, but are still one of those practices that is generating revenue and not seeing a lot of profit, or you're feeling like the business is running you instead of the other way around. You have to attend. You're on a trajectory for burnout. In the three days in the conference, you and your leadership team will walk away with a personalized 90 day implementation plan to scale your profits, optimize your operations and help you truly step into your role as CEO. We back every seat with a 10 X ticket guarantee.

[00:15:58] Go to ppoclubevents.com right now to secure your spot. ppoclubevents.com. And I hope to see you in San Antonio in October. And I think another part that goes, I can't think of a different word besides unnoticed, but it doesn't get enough recognition is, is the need to really define those expectations in a job description. So, okay, we know our numbers.

[00:16:23] Now, what are the systems that we need to create that will produce the numbers that we're expecting? Right. And that goes into how can we create systems that will replicate over and over again. If we follow those systems, we know we're going to get this product. So as we're looking at the first place I go is still just knowing the metrics, I don't think is enough. Of course you have to communicate, but I think creating the system might be that next step.

[00:16:52] Correct me if I'm wrong, but as I'm just thinking through this, you might need to put together some job descriptions, some training or resources on how do we get what we're expecting? Because if we're looking at a therapist, they're really expected to do three things, right? They need to provide great care. They need to document for that care really well. And then they need to charge optimally, ethically for the care that they provide, right?

[00:17:20] And so you need to job description around those three things. The only thing that we're going to add on top of that when it comes to production is you need to do all of those three things at a certain level in order for this relationship to work, employee relationship. Me pay you this salary. You need to do those three things at this level in order for this to work.

[00:17:46] And so I think generating some job descriptions, some systems, creating the resources and preparing the training for them is essential. And you could say the same thing for the front desk, right? Their three main responsibilities are fill the schedule, collect every dollar at the time of the appointment, make sure everybody on the schedule arrives on time ready to pay, right? Those three things, that's their main job. And the job description revolves around that.

[00:18:14] And again, they need to do that at a high level. Again, going back to the metrics that we've talked about, what are they expected to do? What are the metrics that we're going to hold them to? And then provide them training and resources behind that. Yeah. And so I think creating these systems is a little bit of a go between between, okay, we know what is expected or let's roll it out. Well, I think we need to have some systems to fall back on and to train with in order for

[00:18:44] those things to be replicated over and over again for years at a time. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Also, you know, a couple of things that are worth mentioning is that it's, this isn't easy. You know what I mean? Like this isn't just because you have a system doesn't mean it's going to be easy to execute. Well, creating the system in and of itself can be a little bit of a grind. If you're starting from scratch, I think that's one of the benefits that some of our coaching

[00:19:11] clients have had is because they've had access to a library or resources of sample job descriptions and some of these things that, so you don't have to start from scratch, right? But you can find them and AI can even help. Well, it's, it's not going to be convenient, right? There's always going to be like when you're trying to deliver care, there's never going to be enough time. Like when you create budgets and constraints on delivery, you're going to force prioritization in some capacity. You know what I mean?

[00:19:41] So it's hard. It's hard to, it's, it's hard. It's a hard thing to do. You know, one of the things I think that's why it's really important to make sure that like systems aside, if you want people to follow them, it's critical that you are really clear on your company mission, your company purpose, your company values and what they mean to you

[00:20:06] and the types of people who typically thrive in your organization, right? So having like a filtering mechanism to make sure you're onboarding the right people into your organization. And that doesn't mean right. People doesn't mean good or bad. It just means they're aligned with you. They're more willing to naturally be inclined to follow the process that you have because they

[00:20:34] see the vision and the values that, that you operate within and your systems are built around that. I think that is so, so, so important. And I learned the lesson the hard way several times, trying to fit the wrong people into the right system. And you start building a, a team that doesn't quite want to go where you are trying where you need to go. And that does, nobody wins the company.

[00:21:05] They lose because they're not happy. The patients aren't getting consistent quality care like they need. So like, I would say, make sure you have that buttoned up too. That could be an entire podcast episode unto itself. And I'm probably done it in the past. I mean, we had 400 of them, but the correlation between unaligned team and production, it's just in parallel was they go hand in hand, like the better aligned team with your purpose and

[00:21:34] values, the better your numbers are. It's just how it is. It's crazy. Like just when you offload some of those people who don't align with the purpose and values, you have a smaller team yet production goes boom. Right. And the atmosphere improves and morale just goes through the roof addition by subtraction. Totally. So I'd say, like going back to the principle of it's not as hard as, it's not as complex

[00:22:04] as we might think it is. It's like, we've worked with a lot of practice owners, right? And we've all had challenges with production. Like, how do I get my team to just do it? You know what I mean? Like sometimes a lot of times the answer is you just got the wrong team. A lot of times I would say it's a combination of you not being clear on what you stand for, what your values are, or having the leadership skills to communicate that in a way that's

[00:22:34] persuasive and inviting. Right. It influences people to make change. You don't have to be a wizard. You just got to be sold on your vision and be passionate about it. Right. And, but I think maybe even to a greater degree, it's like, sometimes we just have the wrong people on the team. Like maybe they would be better off in a hospital system, or maybe they'd be better off doing home health or, or, or something like that. Because you can't, I'm not trying to like simplify this too much, but it's like, you can't ask

[00:23:03] a fish to get out of water to start running on their legs. Like they're just, which is not built for that. Right. They don't want to do that. They just want to go swim in the ocean. You know what I mean? Good for them, you know? So, but I will say that if you have that clear, if you have some systems in place, right, some basic systems, you kind of know your metrics and you're really clear on who the right person is for your company. And you're willing to say no to the wrong people. Be like, you know what?

[00:23:30] Listen, I value you, but like, I don't think that you're going to thrive here and only bring the right people. A lot of things just really start moving in the right direction naturally organically because you've got a good aligned team. So I'd say it doesn't have to be forced. Yeah. Yeah. I'm so glad you brought it up because there's plenty of owners who are listening. Like, yeah, I've got this team. It's hard to get them to produce.

[00:23:58] And it can definitely go back to know your metrics, get the systems together. But I'm, and I'm glad you brought it up. Like you're going to roll some of this out. Some people aren't going to like it. Let's just say they're not going to like it because it's not how they did things, how we did things in the, and they might even be some of your more quote unquote loyal people. They're like, this is how, isn't how we did things in the past. You're coming to corporate. You're worried about the numbers more than you are about the people.

[00:24:26] You're going to get that kind of kickback or they're going to be silent underminers, right? They're just, they're just not going to say anything and you won't see their numbers move up the way you, or maybe you'll get an initial spike and they'll come back down. Right. And maybe they're not encouraging. Maybe they, you might start them, start seeing them act out a little bit, whether that's rumor mongering or, you know, spreading rumors or just saying snide remarks about you or other

[00:24:55] people behind your backs. And then they act out in that way. And I say all that because for an owner that's trying to make these changes that can hurt personally. And that can be a really hard space because you probably up until this time have not had accountability conversations with them. And you, now you need to learn how to hold them accountable to the metrics. And these are people that you love and you appreciate, and you would like for them to

[00:25:25] stay and you want for them to stay because, you know, getting a replacement can be very hard, but them staying is worse for your organization than keeping them on and suffering them. Right. Yeah. You've seen some of that. Oh, totally. Yeah. Totally. I remember I had to do that with front desk people as I was making changes. I had my lead therapist as I'm making changes, just she was on board, but she just kind of

[00:25:54] started acting out a little bit more and we can't do this. And it sucked. And I remember I was almost in tears going through that conversation with her. Like, I've got to let you go because of X, Y, and Z because it was hard for me. But as over time, as I made the commitment to my purpose and values and held people accountable to the metrics, the culture started changing.

[00:26:20] And then those people, here's the light at the end of the tunnel is you start hiring and keeping people who now, when you hold them accountable, take it on in the right manner and are inspired to do better. And they want to do better and they step up to the challenge. Right. I don't know. You've seen that. Right. They choose the company, they choose the organization. Right.

[00:26:45] And so like, when you say like they decide to choose the company, right. And so like, what that means is they're willing to sacrifice their own personal convenience. And oftentimes like they're willing to embrace the challenge of going along the journey with your company. Business is a hard thing. It's not convenient or natural to be profitable or to grow a business, right.

[00:27:13] Like, or to climb a mountain. Like you're going to have to go through a bunch of stuff. Like you're gonna have to climb rocks and you're, you're gonna have to look at things and be like, this is physically impossible. We have to find a way to get resourceful and creative. Like, and your ability to do that is going to require sacrifice, right? Like in a lot of ways. And you have to have a team that is willing to embrace that journey with you because aligned with you.

[00:27:42] And if you have people who aren't willing to do that with you, and once things get tight and squeezed and things get hard, like every year, like there's Medicaid changes and reimbursement cuts and all of the things that we deal with, your team feels that constraint. Your team feels that pressure. They are not going to be willing to align. They're going to be, they're going to choose their own path, which is going to be counterproductive

[00:28:10] and eventually will become, there'll be no longer, it'll no longer be an ROI for them to be on the team anymore. So it's funny that we're staying on this topic because this is really the hard part because we're so people oriented and we want people to like us. We want to try to find a, we want to create a place where everyone's invited. Yeah. Yeah. So we've got a big tent. Everybody come on in. And that's where the compassion kills us.

[00:28:40] We're so compassionate that we're willing to sacrifice our own and our company's health for the benefit of individuals who don't align with us. Right. So what is the product of that? Right. Like if you, the owner, you design that, right? You design the systems, the onboarding process, the training, the expectations, the metrics, you design that, that job description, you build the culture, you define it, you hold it as

[00:29:07] a standard and you make sure that only the right people come to the team. You are the creator of that. And when that is, when you are staying true to that, what a high performing team looks like is more like, Hey team, we're here, which is not going to be good. We need to be here. Are we good? And everybody says yes. And everything changes. Everything, everything just moves.

[00:29:37] There's not friction. There's not a lot of pushback. There's not a lot of massaging. There might be some questions, but there's clarifying questions that are like, I'm willing to do it. Here's a sticking point. Not, I don't know if we can do that because X, Y, Z, and I don't like how it, how it changes because I don't like it. It's not those kinds of questions. It's clarifying. How do we meet the end goal? Right. And those people are like, yeah.

[00:30:05] And for those people who are listening or like, yeah, that's nice. That would be dream scenario. I think Adam and I are both telling you that we have lived that scenario. We have those kinds of people and we've made these kinds of changes because we put in effort over time to put our company in this position to do so. Yeah. And so it's, it's remarkable how things will just start moving in the right direction because you got the right people around you.

[00:30:34] As opposed to the opposite, when things feel heavy, it's like production's down, like everything's just not quite, you feel stressed. What that typically feels like as an owner, that experience is having the same conversation over and over and over and drama, like drama in the organization.

[00:30:59] And like, you're recognizing that your key people who you trust, who've been with you are being worn down by the business. They're being, they're being drained. Their energy is suffering along with you and they're frustrated. Right. And so you just see the morale of your key people starting to be depleted. That's when, you know, you probably got the wrong people on your team. Right. That's a bad sign. That's a real bad sign.

[00:31:29] Let's say for what it is, number one, you've got some bad people on your team. Number two, you're not stepping up into the leadership role that you need to do and that you need to be. Totally. Totally. I mean, that's kind of on you. If you're seeing good people leave your company, then you need to look in the mirror. Because I think a lot of people, they might bring up the word culture. Like I want a better culture in my organization because, and I think that's, this might be partially

[00:31:59] what they're talking about. Right. They want to improve the culture because they're feeling stuck. They're noticing the drama. Things are hard to change when I'm trying to implement change. We're trying to increase our arrival rate and it's not moving the needle and constantly training people on conversations to get patients to stay engaged and commit to their appointments. Things aren't moving the way I want them to move.

[00:32:25] I hear these guys on the podcast and they're telling us we need to hit these metrics and I'm stuck. I don't have that team. And they're talking about culture. I would like to think that one of our mottos really changed to that when we were in that situation. And that was our motto of production is the basis of morale. When people are productive, the culture improves straight up.

[00:32:51] And the interesting thing is the more you push them to be productive, they will be more engaged in the company. And the people who aren't engaged in the company and with your values will stick out like a sore thumb the more you push them. Correct. And they will eventually be gone. They'll almost self-select. Yeah. They'll just be like, yeah, this doesn't work for me.

[00:33:16] And the hard part about that, and I'm wondering if you could speak to this as well. And I think not just with business owners or rehab professionals, but most everybody in the world, like we generally want to be liked, right? Like we value, there's always a piece of us that wants approval and confirmation from other people. Right.

[00:33:44] And I don't know, like when you get in that situation where you're trying to create a real company and you're trying to create a real organization and you're recognizing that there's a significant. And when I say significant, it could be one or two providers, you know, whatever that word significant means to you. One or two people that are objectively important to the company, but you're recognizing they're probably not going to, they're probably going to be better off, off the team.

[00:34:12] There's not very many chances that you're not going to seem like a bad guy. You know what I mean? Like you're going to have to make a hard call and you can try to do it with as much grace as possible. But no matter what you do, there's always going to be that lingering, that person or that group of people think that you're a jerk.

[00:34:38] And I think part of being a good owner is learning how to be okay with that. Sometimes it is learning how to be like, that's part of the process. And, but taking ownership of it as well and saying like, Hey, that person probably should have never been on the car. That's on me. That's on me for inviting that person in. Now I know, and now we're going to screen a little bit better and make sure that we pick up on those things a little bit quicker.

[00:35:06] It will help a lot if you care less about what people think of you. Yeah. And so like, I say that because I think a lot of people, including myself, we try to build this culture or this company that is awesome that we believe in. And we try to do it in a way that avoids that. Like, how can we build it and avoid looking like a bad person? It's not going to happen, right? It's like, as you build, bring people into your company, you're going to get haters. It's just going to happen.

[00:35:34] Like people are not, everyone's going to like you, you know? And so I think kind of getting into that mindset of like, I'm okay with that. I have to learn how to be okay with pieces of that. I think that's a really important piece to developing a strong culture as well. Oh, for sure. Yeah. And training your team on being okay with that. Well, yeah. And I think not to belabor the point, but if you're not having those accountability sessions because you're worried about the confrontation, it's a very, I think it's coming from a very

[00:36:01] selfish place of, I don't want to look like a bad guy. I want to be the friend. And so you're trying to salvage what you think other people think of you by keeping the friendship and not having the accountability conversation where in the best interest of the organization, in the best interest of the other team members, and in the best interest of that person, you should be having more accountability conversations with them to invite them to grow, to inspire

[00:36:28] them to step up to, because you're not the only company they're going to work for in their lives. And if you can help them see that and show them how to step up in a path to be a better team member, even supervisor, then that will transfer into other parts of their lives. Right? And you withholding those kinds of accountability conversations around production is just selfish. I mean, you're inviting them to step up and to be better people, to be better in their

[00:36:58] roles across the board. And if you're withholding that, you're just doing it because you're worried about sacrificing your image in their eyes. Or your own comfort, your own comfort, for your own comfort and to salvage your ego. Right? And here's the thing going back to, if you have a company and you have some goals, you know what I mean? Like if you have some goals where it's like, I would love to be a little better than average. Like, like, that's it.

[00:37:26] Like, can we be a little better than average? What that means is like, everybody in your company is going to have to give more, be more, do more, challenge themselves. Like, it's going to be harder. They've got to be better than average. Right. Like you have to call people up to that. Yeah. And most people, including you and I, we want convenience. We want comfort. We want it. We want the easy thing. We want to see less patients get paid more.

[00:37:55] We want the, we want the big, we want the big check every month. Right. And it's, you got to have the right people who like want that challenge. Right. Who want to, who want to be motivated by something internal to take that on. You know what I mean? So, so I guess I'm trying to, I guess we are belaboring the point, but just like learning how to navigate that cultural piece as an owner, I think is, in my opinion, the most important I think it's more important than that than the metric sometimes. Definitely.

[00:38:26] What was the most helpful? Maybe it was some resources. Maybe it was a mindset shift. Maybe it was certain, certain exercises. Maybe it was a book that you read. What were some things that helped you get an idea of how those conversations go? If there, maybe there's a template or frame of the conversation and how to focus your, your questions. Were there any resources that you used to help you become better in those accountability conversations? Well, there's a few good books.

[00:38:55] I know you've, you've read the coaching habit. Coaching habit's great. Who wrote that? I should have it. Steiner, something like that. It's a small book. Small book. I think that was probably like the first book that I read. The coaching habit. Coaching habit is a really great book that teaches you how to ask questions that call people up into a place instead of like telling them what to do all the time, which is a skill.

[00:39:20] I think that probably I've built through working with a bunch of coaches. I've built what we call a clarity conversation framework just to kind of give people some language that could be used in those conversations. I think that's important, but I think ultimately the two things that I think may has made the

[00:39:45] biggest, not, not perfect, but like has made the biggest difference for me is number one repetition. Like just doing them, you know, like you're going to feel stupid. You're going to sweat bullets. You're going to look stupid. Honestly, like you're going to afterwards, you're going to say, man, I should have said this, that, or yeah. Yes. You're going to happen. You've got it. And like, literally like the best piece of advice I ever gotten business was like,

[00:40:13] do stuff that you suck at for long enough and eventually you won't suck. Like that's really like the best. Be willing to do that. Like, so that's number one. And I think the second thing is honestly learning more about myself, like being more reflective about those experiences and learning how to understand what influences my own emotions

[00:40:39] and in a positive way and in a negative way, the things that helped me feel safe and seen and heard and learning that about myself helped me try to create more of that for the people that I was, that I'm, that I'm leading. To create a little bit more collaboration, you know? So I would say like learning about yourself, right? It's a big, a leadership journey, a personal leadership journey of some capacity is really important. Yeah. A book that I would add to that is Crucial Conversations.

[00:41:08] The whole idea behind that, or one of the main ideas behind it is the issue being something that is outside of the two people in the conversation so that you can both, for example, put the issue on the table in front of you, if so to say, so that you're both looking at the issue, trying to figure out how to resolve it so that it's, that issue is not part of that person's being. Right.

[00:41:34] And so inviting them into that kind of conversations and in that situation, staying as objective as possible. This is not about you as a person. This is about the need to accomplish X, Y, Z according to expectation. Right. Right. So keeping things objective, putting, making it about the issue. And lastly, I would say tying, it's always helped me and I've said it all the time.

[00:42:01] It's always helped me to tie a company value to what we're talking about. This is an issue because it goes against this value in our organization. For me personally, if I can go in with that mindset, that keeps it objective, that ties it to purpose and values. And not just because I said so, or that it's going to improve the profits of my personal organization, but because it goes against the value and we can't have that if we're going to be a values driven organization.

[00:42:31] Those are some of the thoughts, mindsets, resources that I've used to help me. But I will say the thing that I've seen in you over the years is even when you didn't know, even when, before you had read those, some of those books and had some of those resources to lean on, you were one that was quick to have the conversation. You weren't going to let us sit, let it sit and stew. You were going to have the conversation, even though you didn't know what you were doing at the time. It was going to happen.

[00:43:00] It had to happen. If you wanted to see change, it has to happen. Yeah. And I think the people who align with you will appreciate you having the courage to do that, even if it's messy. So I do want to just re-invite as we wrap this up, re-invite people back out to San Antonio this year. I mean, such a people driven organization, industry, right?

[00:43:29] This is really about people. It's about influence. It's about learning how to try to tie people's passion and purposes into their work. It's not all about strategy and tactics. Sometimes it's just about that. And there are people who are really good at that stuff. You know what I mean? A lot better than me and Nathan. You know what I mean? This is true. They will be on the stage.

[00:43:55] Just imagine if you and two or three people on your team could elevate their leadership by five or 10% this year. Like what type of real change could you make in the lives of your people? And not to mention your finances. You know what I mean? So it's just a little bit more alignment with your people. Like I think you should come to San Antonio if you're on the fence. Like check out the thing below and just like consider it. Yeah.

[00:44:20] October 15th through 17th and ppoclubevents.com or click on the link in the comments. Good conversation today, man. Man, appreciate you having him. All right. Take care. Thanks for listening to the Private Practice Owners Club. If you enjoyed this episode, would you mind doing us a huge favor and leaving a review? This helps us get the podcast out to more clinic owners to help them create greater freedom

[00:44:48] and profits so they can own their future. And visit our website, ppoclub.com to find more resources and connect with us.